PLC Paper No. CB(3) 353

PROVISIONAL LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL
MINUTES
No. 27

Minutes of the meeting held on Wednesday 12 November 1997 at 2:30 pm

Members present:
President
The Hon Mrs Rita FAN, JP
The Hon WONG Siu-yee
The Hon James TIEN Pei-chun, JP
The Hon David CHU Yu-lin
The Hon HO Sai-chu, JP
The Hon Edward HO Sing-tin, JP
Dr Hon Raymond HO Chung-tai, JP
The Hon NG Leung-sing
Prof Hon NG Ching-fai
The Hon LEE Kai-ming
The Hon Mrs Elsie TU, GBM
The Hon Mrs Selina CHOW, JP
The Hon Mrs Peggy LAM, JP
The Hon Henry WU
The Hon NGAI Shiu-kit, JP
The Hon Henry TANG Ying-yen, JP
The Hon Ronald ARCULLI, JP
The Hon YUEN Mo
The Hon MA Fung-kwok
The Hon CHEUNG Hon-chung
Dr Hon Mrs TSO WONG Man-yin
The Hon LEUNG Chun-ying, JP
Dr Hon LEONG Che-hung, JP
The Hon Mrs Sophie LEUNG LAU Yau-fun, JP
The Hon MOK Ying-fan
The Hon HUI Yin-fat, JP
The Hon CHAN Choi-hi
The Hon CHAN Yuen-han
The Hon CHAN Wing-chan
The Hon CHAN Kam-lam
The Hon TSANG Yok-sing
The Hon CHENG Kai-nam
The Hon Frederick FUNG Kin-kee
The Hon Andrew WONG Wang-fat, JP
Dr Hon Philip WONG Yu-hong
The Hon Kennedy WONG Ying-ho
The Hon Howard YOUNG, JP
Dr Hon Charles YEUNG Chun-kam
The Hon YEUNG Yiu-chung
The Hon IP Kwok-him
The Hon CHIM Pui-chung
The Hon Bruce LIU Sing-lee
The Hon LAU Kong-wah
The Hon LAU Wong-fat, JP
The Hon Mrs Miriam LAU Kin-yee, JP
The Hon Ambrose LAU Hon-chuen, JP
The Hon CHOY Kan-pui, JP
The Hon Paul CHENG Ming-fun, JP
The Hon CHENG Yiu-tong
Dr Hon TANG Siu-tong, JP
The Hon Timothy FOK Tsun-ting
The Hon KAN Fook-yee
The Hon NGAN Kam-chuen
The Hon LO Suk-ching
Dr Hon LAW Cheung-kwok
The Hon TAM Yiu-chung, JP
The Hon CHOY So-yuk

Members absent:
The Hon Eric LI Ka-cheung, JP
Dr Hon David LI Kwok-po, JP
The Hon Allen LEE, JP

Public officers attending:

The Honourable Mrs Anson CHAN, JP

The Chief Secretary for Administration

The Honourable Donald TSANG Yam-kuen, JP

The Financial Secretary

Mr Michael SUEN Ming yeung, JP

Secretary for Constitutional Affairs

Mr CHAU Tak-hay, JP

Secretary for Broadcasting, Culture and Sport

Mr Nicholas NG Wing-fui, JP

Secretary for Transport

Mr Dominic WONG Shing-wah, JP

Secretary for Housing

Mr Joseph WONG Wing-ping, JP

Secretary for Education and Manpower

Mr Rafael HUI Si-yan, JP

Secretary for Financial Services

Mr Peter LAI Hing ling, JP

Secretary for Security

Mr Bowen LEUNG Po wing, JP

Secretary for Planning, Environment and Lands

Mr David LAN Hong-tsung, JP

Secretary for Home Affairs

Miss Denise YUE Chung-yee, JP

Secretary for Trade and Industry

Clerks in attendance:

Mr Ricky FUNG Choi-cheung, JP

Secretary General

Mr LAW Kam-sang, JP

Deputy Secretary General

Mrs Justina LAM CHENG Bo-ling

Assistant Secretary General (2)

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Papers

The following papers were laid on the table pursuant to Rule 21(2) of the Rules of Procedure:

Sessional Papers

Questions

1. Dr TANG Siu-tong asked Question 1.

The Secretary for Transport replied.

Nine Members asked supplementaries and the Secretary for Transport replied.

2. Mr Ambrose LAU asked Question 2.

The Secretary for Home Affairs replied.

12 Members asked supplementaries. The Secretary for Home Affairs, the Secretary for Housing, the Secretary for Education and Manpower and the Secretary for Security replied.

3. Mr CHENG Kai-nam asked Question 3.

The Secretary for Security replied.

Seven Members asked supplementaries and the Secretary for Security replied.

4. Mr HUI Yin-fat asked Question 4.

The Secretary for Housing replied.

Seven Members asked supplementaries and the Secretary for Housing replied.

5. Mr Paul CHENG asked Question 5.

The Secretary for Constitutional Affairs replied.

Four Members asked supplementaries. The Secretary for Constitutional Affairs and the Secretary for Trade and Industry replied.

6. Mr K K FUNG asked Question 6.

The Secretary for Planning, Environment and Lands replied.

A Member asked supplementaries and the Secretary for Planning, Environment and Lands replied.

As the Question Time had lasted for over two hours, which was much longer than the usual duration of about one hour, the President reminded Members that they should avoid long introduction and expressing opinions before asking supplementary questions. She suggested that the House Committee consider reviewing how supplementary questions should be raised and the duration of Question Time at Council meetings.

Written replies to Questions 7 to 20 were tabled for Members�information.

Bill

Second Reading
Sex Discrimination (Amendment) Bill 1997

Resumption of debate on Second Reading which had been moved on 29 October 1997.

Question on Second Reading put and agreed to.

Bill read the second time and committed to a Committee of the whole Council.

Committee Stage

The Council went into Committee and considered the Sex Discrimination (Amendment) Bill 1997.

Question that clauses 1 to 5 stand part of the Bill proposed, put and agreed to.

The Council then resumed.

Third Reading

The Secretary for Financial Services reported that

the Sex Discrimination (Amendment) Bill 1997

had passed through Committee without amendment. He moved that the Bill be read the third time and do pass.

Question on the Third Reading proposed, put and agreed to.

Bill read the third time and passed.

Members' Motions

Recruiting native English-speaking teachers of English for Hong Kong secondary schools

Mrs Elsie TU moved the following motion and addressed the Council:

That this Council requests the Government to take into consideration the views of Members of the Provisional Legislative Council on the proposal to provide more than 700 additional native English-speaking teachers of English for Hong Kong secondary schools.

At 5:07 pm, the President's Deputy took the chair during the temporary absence of the President.

Question on the motion proposed.

Nine Members and the Secretary for Education and Manpower spoke on the motion.

At 6:00 pm, the President resumed the chair.

Mrs Elsie TU replied.

Question on the motion put and agreed to.

The Building Safety Inspection Scheme

Mr TSANG Yok-sing moved the following motion and addressed the Council:

That, in view of the fact that a large number of private property owners will be affected by the mandatory Building Safety Inspection Scheme to be implemented by the Buildings Department, this Council urges the Government to undertake the responsibility for the inspection of buildings, and to establish a building maintenance fund to provide assistance to building owners having difficulty meeting the repair costs; furthermore, the implementation of the Scheme should first be targeted at the oldest or the most dangerous buildings.

Question on Mr TSANG Yok-sing's motion proposed. The President stated that Mr Edward HO and Mr K K FUNG had separately given notice to move amendments to the motion. She proposed that the motion and the two proposed amendments be debated together in a joint debate. There being no dissenting voice, the President ordered that the motion and the two proposed amendments be debated together.

The President invited Mr Edward HO and Mr K K FUNG to speak on the motion and their proposed amendments. She added, however, that they might not move their proposed amendments at that stage.

Mr Edward HO and Mr K K FUNG spoke on the motion and their own proposed amendments.

Four Members spoke on the motion and the proposed amendments.

At 7:00 pm, the President's Deputy took the chair during the temporary absence of the President.

Another four Members spoke on the motion and the proposed amendments.

At 7:17 pm, the President resumed the chair.

Four more Members spoke on the motion and the proposed amendments.

Mr TSANG Yok-sing spoke on the proposed amendments.

The Secretary for Planning, Environment and Lands spoke on the motion and the proposed amendments.

Mr Edward HO moved the following amendment to Mr TSANG Yok-sing's motion:

To delete "undertake the responsibility for the inspection of buildings" and substitute with "offer an alternative to property owners by providing an inspection and certification service to be charged at cost"; to delete ";" from "meeting the repair costs;" and substitute with "."; to delete "furthermore" and substitute with "Furthermore"; to delete "first" and "targeted at" from "the Scheme should first be targeted at"; and to add "for buildings over 30 years old and priority should be given to" before "the oldest or the most dangerous buildings".

Question on Mr Edward HO's amendment to Mr TSANG Yok-sing's motion proposed and put.

Mr Edward HO claimed a division. The President then ordered the Council to divide under Rule 47(4) of the Rules of Procedure.

The President announced that there were eight votes for the amendment, 22 votes against it and five abstentions. (Voting record in Appendix I.) She declared that Mr Edward HO's amendment to Mr TSANG Yok-sing's motion was negatived.

Mr K K FUNG moved the following amendment to Mr TSANG Yok-sing's motion:

To delete "the implementation of the Scheme should first be targeted at the oldest or the most dangerous buildings" and substitute with "the Scheme should first be targeted at buildings over 40 years old and be implemented by phases according to the age of the buildings, and the duration of inspection cycles should be increased from 7 to 10 years, so as to achieve the aim of systematically eliminating the potential dangers posed by aged buildings".

Question on Mr K K FUNG's amendment to Mr TSANG Yok-sing's motion proposed and put.

Mr K K FUNG claimed a division. The President then ordered the Council to divide under Rule 47(4) of the Rules of Procedure.

The President announced that there were four votes for the amendment, 22 votes against it and eight abstentions. (Voting record in Appendix II.) She declared that Mr K K FUNG's amendment to Mr TSANG Yok-sing's motion was negatived.

Mr TSANG Yok-sing replied.

Question on Mr TSANG Yok-sing's motion put. The President said that she thought the motion was carried.

Mr TSANG Yok-sing claimed a division. The President then ordered the Council to divide under Rule 47(4) of the Rules of Procedure.

The President announced that there were 25 votes for the motion, eight votes against it and one abstention. (Voting record in Appendix III.) She declared that Mr TSANG Yok-sing's motion was carried.

Next meeting

The President declared that the next meeting of the Council would be held on 19 November 1997 at 2:30 pm.

The Council was adjourned at 8:25 pm.

(Mrs Rita FAN)President
Council Chamber
Hong Kong

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