LC Paper No. CB(3) 578/98-99

LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL

MINUTES
No. 14
Minutes of the meeting held on Wednesday 4 November 1998 at 2:30 pm

Members present:

President
The Hon Mrs Rita FAN, GBS, JP
The Hon Kenneth TING Woo-shou, JP
The Hon James TIEN Pei-chun, JP
The Hon David CHU Yu-lin
The Hon HO Sai-chu, JP
The Hon Cyd HO Sau-lan
The Hon Edward HO Sing-tin, JP
The Hon Albert HO Chun-yan
The Hon Michael HO Mun-ka
Dr the Hon Raymond HO Chung-tai, JP
The Hon LEE Wing-tat
The Hon LEE Cheuk-yan
The Hon Martin LEE Chu-ming, SC, JP
The Hon Eric LI Ka-cheung, JP
The Hon LEE Kai-ming, JP
Dr the Hon David LI Kwok-po, JP
The Hon Fred LI Wah-ming
Dr the Hon LUI Ming-wah, JP
The Hon NG Leung-sing
Prof the Hon NG Ching-fai
The Hon Margaret NG
The Hon Mrs Selina CHOW LIANG Shuk-yee, JP
The Hon MA Fung-kwok
The Hon James TO Kun-sun
The Hon CHEUNG Man-kwong
The Hon Ambrose CHEUNG Wing-sum, JP
The Hon HUI Cheung-ching
The Hon Christine LOH
The Hon CHAN Kwok-keung
The Hon CHAN Yuen-han
The Hon Bernard CHAN
The Hon CHAN Wing-chan
The Hon CHAN Kam-lam
Dr the Hon LEONG Che-hung, JP
The Hon Mrs Sophie LEUNG LAU Yau-fun, JP
The Hon LEUNG Yiu-chung
The Hon Gary CHENG Kai-nam
The Hon SIN Chung-kai
The Hon Andrew WONG Wang-fat, JP
Dr the Hon Philip WONG Yu-hong
The Hon WONG Yung-kan
The Hon Jasper TSANG Yok-sing, JP
The Hon Howard YOUNG, JP
Dr the Hon YEUNG Sum
The Hon YEUNG Yiu-chung
The Hon LAU Chin-shek, JP
The Hon LAU Kong-wah
The Hon LAU Wong-fat, GBS, JP
The Hon Mrs Miriam LAU Kin-yee, JP
The Hon Ambrose LAU Hon-chuen, JP
The Hon Emily LAU Wai-hing, JP
The Hon CHOY So-yuk
The Hon Andrew CHENG Kar-foo
The Hon SZETO Wah
The Hon Timothy FOK Tsun-ting, JP
The Hon LAW Chi-kwong, JP
The Hon TAM Yiu-chung, JP
The Hon FUNG Chi-kin
Dr the Hon TANG Siu-tong, JP

Member absent:

The Hon Ronald ARCULLI, JP

Public officers attending:

The Honourable Mrs Anson CHAN, JP

The Chief Secretary for Administration

The Honourable Donald TSANG Yam-kuen, JP

The Financial Secretary

The Honourable Elsie LEUNG Oi-sie, JP

The Secretary for Justice

Mr Michael SUEN Ming-yeung, JP

Secretary for Constitutional Affairs

Mr CHAU Tak-hay, JP

Secretary for Trade and Industry

Mr Nicholas NG Wing-fui, JP

Secretary for Transport

Mr Dominic WONG Shing-wah, JP

Secretary for Housing

Mrs Katherine FOK LO Shiu-ching, JP

Secretary for Health and Welfare

Mr Rafael HUI Si-yan, GBS, JP

Secretary for Financial Services

Mr Joseph WONG Wing-ping, GBS, JP

Secretary for Education and Manpower

Mr Bowen LEUNG Po-wing, JP

Secretary for Planning, Environment and Lands

Mr KWONG Ki-chi, GBS, JP

Secretary for Information Technology and Broadcasting

Miss Denise YUE Chung-yee, JP

Secretary for the Treasury

Mr LAM Woon-kwong, JP

Secretary for the Civil Service

Mr Stephen IP Shu-kwan, JP

Secretary for Economic Services

Mr Benedict KWONG Hon-sang, JP

Secretary for Works

Mr David LAN Hong-tsung, JP

Secretary for Home Affairs

Mrs Regina IP LAU Suk-yee, JP

Secretary for Security

Clerks in attendance:

Mr Ricky FUNG Choi-cheung, JP,

Secretary General

Mr LAW Kam-sang, JP,

Deputy Secretary General

Taking of Legislative Council Oath

Dr Hon TANG Siu-tong took the Legislative Council Oath.

Papers

The following papers were laid on the table pursuant to Rule 21(2) of the Rules of Procedure:

Subsidiary Legislation	L.N. No.
1.Import and Export (Registration) (Amendment) (No.2) Regulation 1998	334/98
2.Specification of Arrangements (Government of the Kingdom of Belgium Concerning Air Services) (Double Taxation) Order	335/98
3.Specification of Arrangements (Government of the State of Israel Concerning Air Services) (Double Taxation) Order	336/98
4.Designation of Libraries (Urban Council Area) (No.3) Order 1998	337/98
5.Adaptation of Laws (Nationality Related Matters) Ordinance (28 of 1998) (Commencement) Notice 1998	338/98
6.Fugitive Offenders (New Zealand) Order (L.N. 263 of 1998) (Commencement) Notice 1998	339/98

Sessional Papers

No.46	-	Land Development Corporation Annual Report 1997-1998
No.47	-	Vocational Training Council Annual Report 1996/97
No.48	-	The audited Statements of Accounts of the Provisional Regional Council for the financial year ended 31 March 1998 and the Director of Audit's Report
No.49	-	Regional Council Annual Report 1997-98
No.50	-	The audited Statement of Assets and Liabilities, Statements of Receipts and Payments and Statement of Revenue and Expenditure by Select Committees of the Provisional Urban Council for the year ended 31 March 1998 and the Director of Audit's Report
No.51	-	Urban Council/Provisional Urban Council Annual Report 1997/98
No.52	-	The Hong Kong Industrial Estates Corporation Annual Report 1997-1998
No.53	-	Hong Kong Industrial Technology Centre Corporation Annual Report 97-98
No.54	-	Hong Kong Productivity Council Annual Report 1997/98
No.55	-	The Government Minute in response to the Tenth Annual Report of the Ombudsman issued in July 1998

The Chief Secretary for Administration presented the Government Minute in response to the Tenth Annual Report of the Ombudsman issued in July 1998 and addressed the Council.

Questions

Written replies to Questions 1 to 20 were tabled for Members' information.

Bills

First Reading

Introduction of the Euro Bill
Immigration (Amendment) (No.2) Bill 1998

The Bills were read the first time and ordered to be set down for Second Reading pursuant to Rule 53(3) of the Rules of Procedure.

Second Reading

Introduction of the Euro Bill

The Secretary for Financial Services moved the Second Reading and addressed the Council.

Question on the Second Reading proposed. The President stated that in accordance with Rule 54(4) of the Rules of Procedure, the debate was adjourned and the Bill was referred to the House Committee.

Immigration (Amendment) (No.2) Bill 1998

The Secretary for Security moved the Second Reading and addressed the Council.
Question on the Second Reading proposed. The President stated that in accordance with Rule 54(4) of the Rules of Procedure, the debate was adjourned and the Bill was referred to the House Committee.

Members' Motion

Motion of Thanks

The debate on the Motion of Thanks moved on 21 October 1998 continued.

Two Members spoke on the motion and the amendments.

Dr Hon LEONG Che-hung spoke on the amendments.

The Financial Secretary, the Secretary for Education and Manpower, the Secretary for Economic Services, the Secretary for Trade and Industry, the Secretary for Information Technology and Broadcasting, the Secretary for Transport, the Secretary for Works, the Secretary for Planning, Environment and Lands, the Secretary for Health and Welfare, the Secretary for Security, the Secretary for Constitutional Affairs, and the Secretary for Justice spoke on the motion and the amendments.

When the Secretary for Justice was speaking on the motion and the amendments, Hon Andrew WONG requested to seek elucidation in accordance with Rule 39 of the Rules of Procedure. In response to the question of the President, the Secretary for Justice said that she would like to continue with her speech first.

After the Secretary for Justice had finished her speech, the President called upon Hon Andrew WONG who asked the Secretary for Justice to clarify part of her speech.

The Secretary for Justice replied.

Hon Andrew WONG rose again to raise more queries with the Secretary. The President ruled that Hon Andrew WONG could raise the issues in the form of a question to be asked during the Council's question time.

The Chief Secretary for Administration spoke on the motion and the amendments.

Hon LEE Cheuk-yan moved the following amendment to Dr Hon LEONG Che-hung's motion:

To add ", but since the Chief Executive has not only failed to admit the Government's policy blunders in the past year, review them seriously and account for them, but has also failed to propose in the Policy Address effective measures to promote democracy, restore the economy, ease unemployment and improve people's livelihood, thereby further undermining public confidence in the Government's administration of various policies, this Council expresses deep regret" after "That this Council thanks the Chief Executive for his address".

Question on Hon LEE Cheuk-yan's amendment proposed and put.

Hon CHAN Wing-chan claimed a division. The President then ordered the Council to divide under Rule 47(1) of the Rules of Procedure.

The President announced that among the Members returned by functional constituencies, 28 were present, four were in favour of the amendment, 22 against it and two abstained; while among the Members returned by geographical constituencies through direct elections and by the Election Committee, 30 were present, 13 were in favour of the amendment and 16 against it. (Voting record in Appendix I.) Since the question was not agreed by a majority of each of the two groups of Members present, she declared that the amendment was negatived.

Hon Christine LOH moved the following amendment to Dr Hon LEONG Che-hung's motion:

To add "but is of the view that various policy areas were not well-developed or neglected, thereby losing an opportunity to increase public confidence" after "That this Council thanks the Chief Executive for his address".

Question on Hon Christine LOH's amendment proposed and put. Hon Christine LOH claimed a division. The President then ordered the Council to divide under Rule 47(1) of the Rules of Procedure.

The President announced that among the Members returned by functional constituencies, 28 were present, four were in favour of the amendment, 22 against it and two abstained; while among the Members returned by geographical constituencies through direct elections and by the Election Committee, 30 were present, 14 were in favour of the amendment and 15 against it. (Voting record in Appendix II.) Since the question was not agreed by a majority of each of the two groups of Members present, she declared that the amendment was negatived.

Hon Martin LEE moved the following amendment to Dr Hon LEONG Che-hung's motion:

To add ", but deeply regrets that the Policy Address lacks effective measures to ease unemployment and alleviate people's hardship, and proposes to abolish the two municipal councils, thereby moving against the democratic trend and towards executive hegemony; this Council also urges the Chief Executive to make every effort to safeguard Hong Kong's free economy and legal system, build a democratic, free and pluralistic society, as well as promote long-term developments through independent and novel thinking, so as to restore public confidence" after "That this Council thanks the Chief Executive for his address".

Question on Hon Martin LEE's amendment proposed and put.

Hon Martin LEE claimed a division. The President then ordered the Council to divide under Rule 47(1) of the Rules of Procedure.

The President announced that among the Members returned by functional constituencies, 28 were present, five were in favour of the amendment, 22 against it and one abstained; while among the Members returned by geographical constituencies through direct elections and by the Election Committee, 30 were present, 13 were in favour of the amendment and 16 against it. (Voting record in Appendix III.) Since the question was not agreed by a majority of each of the two groups of Members present, she declared that the amendment was negatived.

Dr Hon LEONG Che-hung replied.

Question on Dr Hon LEONG Che-hung's original motion put.

Dr Hon LEONG Che-hung claimed a division. The President then ordered the Council to divide under Rule 47(1) of the Rules of Procedure. The President announced that among the Members returned by functional constituencies, 28 were present, 23 were in favour of the motion and five against it; while among the Members returned by geographical constituencies through direct elections and by the Election Committee, 30 were present, 15 were in favour of the motion and 14 against it. (Voting record in Appendix IV.) Since the question was not agreed by a majority of each of the two groups of Members present, she declared that the motion was negatived.

Next Meeting

The President declared that the next meeting of the Council would be held on 11 November 1998 at 2:30 pm.

The Council was adjourned at 6:27 pm.

(Mrs Rita FAN)
President
24 November 1998

Council Chamber
Hong Kong