LegCo Paper No. CB 216/95-96

THE LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL
MINUTES
No. 8 of 1995/96

Minutes of the sitting held on Wednesday 22 November 1995 at 2.30 p.m.

Present:

    President : The Honourable Andrew WONG Wang-fat, O.B.E., J.P.
    The Honourable Allen LEE Peng-fei, C.B.E., J.P.
    The Honourable Mrs. Selina CHOW LIANG Shuk-yee, O.B.E., J.P.
    The Honourable Martin LEE Chu-ming, Q.C., J.P.
    Dr. the Honourable David LI Kwok-po, O.B.E., LL.D.(Cantab), J.P.
    The Honourable NGAI Shiu-kit, O.B.E., J.P.
    The Honourable SZETO Wah
    The Honourable LAU Wong-fat, O.B.E., J.P.
    The Honourable Edward HO Sing-tin, O.B.E., J.P.
    The Honourable Ronald Joseph ARCULLI, O.B.E., J.P.
    The Honourable Mrs. Miriam LAU Kin-yee, O.B.E., J.P.
    Dr. the Honourable Edward LEONG Che-hung, O.B.E., J.P.
    The Honourable Albert CHAN Wai-yip
    The Honourable CHEUNG Man-kwong
    The Honourable CHIM Pui-chung
    The Honourable Frederick FUNG Kin-kee
    The Honourable Michael HO Mun-ka
    Dr. the Honourable HUANG Chen-ya, M.B.E.
    The Honourable Emily LAU Wai-hing
    The Honourable LEE Wing-tat
    The Honourable Eric LI Ka-cheung, J.P.
    The Honourable Fred LI Wah-ming
    The Honourable Henry TANG Ying-yen, J.P.
    The Honourable James TO Kun-sun
    Dr. the Honourable Samuel WONG Ping-wai, M.B.E., F.Eng., J.P.
    Dr. the Honourable Philip WONG Yu-hong
    Dr. the Honourable YEUNG Sum
    The Honourable Howard YOUNG, J.P.
    The Honourable Zachary WONG Wai-yin
    The Honourable James TIEN Pei-chun, O.B.E., J.P.
    The Honourable LEE Cheuk-yan
    The Honourable CHAN Kam-lam
    The Honourable CHAN Wing-chan
    The Honourable CHAN Yuen-han
    The Honourable Andrew CHENG Kar-foo
    The Honourable Paul CHENG Ming-fun
    The Honourable CHENG Yiu-tong
    The Honourable Anthony CHEUNG Bing-leung
    The Honourable CHEUNG Hon-chung
    The Honourable CHOY Kan-pui, J.P.
    The Honourable David CHU Yu-lin
    The Honourable Albert HO Chun-yan
    The Honourable IP Kwok-him
    The Honourable LAU Chin-shek
    The Honourable Ambrose LAU Hon-chuen, J.P.
    Dr. the Honourable LAW Cheung-kwok
    The Honourable LEE Kai-ming
    The Honourable LEUNG Yiu-chung
    The Honourable Bruce LIU Sing-lee
    The Honourable LO Suk-ching
    The Honourable MOK Ying-fan
    The Honourable Margaret NG
    The Honourable NGAN Kam-chuen
    The Honourable SIN Chung-kai
    The Honourable TSANG Kin-shing
    Dr. the Honourable John TSE Wing-ling
    The Honourable Mrs. Elizabeth WONG CHIEN Chi-lien, C.B.E., I.S.O., J.P.
    The Honourable Lawrence YUM Sin-ling

Absent:

    The Honourable Christine LOH Kung-wai
    The Honourable LAW Chi-kwong

In attendance:

The Honourable Mrs. Anson CHAN, C.B.E., J.P.
The Chief Secretary
The Honourable Jeremy Fell MATHEWS, C.M.G., J.P.
The Attorney General
Mr. Gordon SIU Kwing-chue, J.P.
Secretary for Economic Services
Mr. Dominic WONG Shing-wah, O.B.E., J.P.
Secretary for Housing
Mrs. Katherine FOK LO Shiu-ching, O.B.E., J.P.
Secretary for Health and Welfare
Mr. Joseph WONG Wing-ping, J.P.
Secretary for Education and Manpower
Mr. Peter LAI Hing-ling, J.P.
Secretary for Security

Clerks to the Legislative Council:

    Mr. Ricky FUNG Choi-cheung, Secretary General
    Mr. LAW Kam-sang, Deputy Secretary General
    Miss Pauline NG Man-wah, Assistant Secretary General (1)

PAPERS

The following papers were laid on the table pursuant to Standing Order 14(2) :

Subsidiary Legislation

L.N. NO.

1. Boilers and Pressure Vessels (Exemption)(Consolidation) (Amendment) Order 1995

519/95

2. Census and Statistics (Monthly Survey of Retail Sales) (Amendment) Order 1995

520/95

3. Census and Statistics (Quarterly Survey of Industrial Production) (Amendment) Order 1995

521/95

4. Official Languages (Alteration of Text) (Money Lenders Ordinance) Order 1995

522/95

5. Port Control (Public Cargo Working Area) (No.4) Order 1995

523/95

6. Overseas Lawyers (Qualification for Admission) (Amendment) Rules 1995

524/95

7. Overseas Lawyers (Qualification for Admission) (Fees) (Amendment) Rules 1995

525/95

8. Intestate Succession (Reckoning of Capital Value) Notice

526/95

9. Acetylating Substances (Control) (Amendment) Ordinance 1994 (64 of 1994) (Commencement) Notice 1995

527/95

10. Land Survey Ordinance (28 of 1995) (Commencement) (No.2) Notice 1995

528/95

11. Road Traffic (Amendment) Ordinance 1995 (39 of 1995) (Commencement) Notice 1995

529/95

12. Official Languages (Amendment) Ordinance 1995 (51 of 1995) (Commencement) Notice 1995

530/95

13. Administration of Justice (Miscellaneous Provisions) (No.2) Ordinance 1995 (68 of 1995) (Commencement) (No.2) Notice 1995

531/95

14. Official Languages (Authentic Chinese Text) (Independent Commission Against Corruption Ordinance) Order

(C) 98/95

15. Official Languages (Authentic Chinese Text) (Hong Kong Industrial Estates Corporation Ordinance) Order

(C) 99/95

16. Official Languages (Authentic Chinese Text) (Oil (Conservation and Control) Ordinance) Order

(C)100/95

17. Official Languages (Authentic Chinese Text) (Homicide Ordinance) Order

(C)101/95

18. Official Languages (Authentic Chinese Text) (Money Lenders Ordinance) Order

(C)102/95

Sessional Paper 1995/96

No. 26 - AIDS Trust Fund1994-95 Annual Accounts

QUESTIONS

1. Dr. Samuel WONG asked Question 1.

The Secretary for Economic Services replied.

Four Members asked supplementaries and the Secretary for Economic Services replied.

2. Dr. LAW Cheung-kwok asked Question 2.

The Secretary for Education and Manpower replied.

Two Members asked supplementaries and the Secretary for Education and Manpower replied.

3. Mr. Allen LEE asked Question 3.

The Secretary for Security replied.

Four Members asked supplementaries and the Secretary for Security replied.

4. Mr. James TO asked Question 4.

The Secretary for Economic Services replied.

Two Members asked supplementaries and the Secretary for Economic Services replied.

5. Mr. Andrew CHENG asked Question 5.

The Secretary for Education and Manpower replied.

Four Members asked supplementaries and the Secretary for Education and Manpower replied.

6. Mr. CHOY Kan-pui asked Question 6.

The Secretary for Housing replied.

Six Members asked supplementaries and the Secretary for Housing replied.

Written replies to Questions 7 to 20 were tabled for Members’ information.

BILL

FIRST READING

Rehabilitation of Offenders (Amendment) Bill 1995

The bill was read the first time and ordered to be set down for second reading pursuant to Standing Order 41(3).

SECOND READING

Rehabilitation of Offenders (Amendment) Bill 1995

The Secretary for Security moved the second reading and addressed the Council.

PRIVATE MEMBER'S MOTIONS

MONITORING OF GAS SUPPLY AND CHARGES

Mr. LAU Chin-shek moved the following motion and addressed the Council:

That this Council urges the Government to promptly study and respond to the Consumer Council’s ‘Report on Assessing Competition In Domestic Water-heating And Cooking Fuel Market’, and introduce legislation to regulate domestic fuel suppliers, in particular the Hong Kong and China Gas Company Limited, in regard to their fuel supply and charges, in order to protect the interests of consumers.

Question on Mr. LAU Chin-shek's motion proposed.

Dr. LAW Cheung-kwok moved the following amendment to Mr. LAU Chin-shek's motion and addressed the Council :

To insert after “That” the following “, in view of the fact that the Hong Kong and China Gas Company Limited already has a market share of over 50% in the domestic water-heating and cooking fuel market,”; and to delete “promptly study and respond to the Consumer Council’s ‘Report on Assessing Competition In Domestic Water-heating And Cooking Fuel Market’, and introduce legislation to regulate domestic fuel suppliers, in particular the Hong Kong and China Gas Company Limited, in regard to their fuel supply and charges” and substitute with “actively consider bringing in new suppliers and to promptly introduce legislation to regulate the operation of the gas company”.

Question on Dr. LAW Cheung-kwok's amendment to Mr. LAU Chin-shek's motion proposed.

20 Members and the Secretary for Economic Services spoke on the motion and the amendment.

Mr. LAU Chin-shek spoke on the amendment.

Question on Dr. LAW Cheung-kwok's amendment to Mr. LAU Chin-shek's motion put. The President stated that he thought the amendment had been negatived.

Mr. K.K. FUNG claimed a division. The President then ordered the Council to divide under Standing Order 36(4).

The President announced that there were nine votes for the amendment and 21 votes against it. (Voting record in Annex I.) He declared that Dr. LAW Cheung-kwok's amendment to Mr. LAU Chin-shek's motion was negatived.

Mr. LAU Chin-shek replied.

Question on Mr. LAU Chin-shek's motion put. The President stated that he thought the motion had been carried.

Mr. LAU Chin-shek claimed a division. The President then ordered the Council to divide under Standing Order 36(4).

The President announced that there were 31 votes for the motion and 22 votes against it. (Voting record in Annex II.) He declared that Mr. LAU Chin-shek's motion was carried.

UNEMPLOYMENT ASSISTANCE SCHEME

Miss CHAN Yuen-han moved the following motion and addressed the Council :

That, in view of Hong Kong’s escalating unemployment rate, the worsening unemployment problem, the increasing financial hardship confronting the unemployed workers, and the failure of the current Comprehensive Social Security Assistance Scheme to relieve their immediate need, this Council urges the Government to set up an Unemployment Assistance Scheme and to provide those unemployed persons who are in need of assistance with an amount no less than one-third of Hong Kong employees’ median income.

Question on Miss CHAN Yuen-han's motion proposed.

Mr. Fred LI and Mr. K.K. FUNG addressed the Council on the motion and their proposed amendments respectively.

At 6:35 p.m., the President's Deputy took the chair during the temporary absence of the President.

Three Members spoke on the motion and the amendments.

At 7:03 p.m., the President resumed the chair.

Another 18 Members and the Secretary for Education and Manpower and the Secretary for Health and Welfare spoke on the motion and the amendments.

Mr. Fred LI moved the following amendment to Miss CHAN Yuen-han's motion :

To insert “(CSSA)” before “Scheme”; to delete all the words after “this Council urges the Government to” and substitute with the following:

“immediately increase the standard rates of CSSA to $2,750 for the unemployed as well as to relax the limit of disposable assets under the Scheme so as to benefit more unemployed persons”.

Question on Mr. Fred LI's amendment to Miss CHAN Yuen-han's motion proposed.

Miss CHAN Yuen-han spoke on the amendments.

The President stated that Members who had not spoken previously in the joint debate might speak.

A further three Members spoke on the motion and the amendments.

In response to points of order raised by some Members, the President ruled that Members who had not spoken in the joint debate on the motion and the amendments had the right to claim the floor after the question on the amendment had been proposed and he could not prevent them from speaking.

Question on Mr. Fred LI's amendment to Miss CHAN Yuen-han's motion put. The President stated that he thought the amendment had been negatived.

Mr. LEE Wing-tat claimed a division. The President then ordered the Council to divide under Standing Order 36(4).

The President announced that there were 22 votes for the amendment and 22 votes against it. (Voting record in Annex III.)

The President suspended the sitting at 9:24 p.m.

The Council resumed at 9:33 p.m.

The President stated that in accordance with the relevant principle on which the casting vote was exercised in the UK House of Common, he exercised his casting vote in the negative and declared that Mr. Fred LI's amendment was negatived.

Mr. K.K. FUNG moved the following amendment to Miss CHAN Yuen-han's motion :

To delete “and to provide those unemployed persons who are in need of assistance with an amount” and substitute with “to provide persons who have been unemployed for more than three months with no more than six months of assistance amounting to”.

Question on Mr. K.K. FUNG's amendment to Miss CHAN Yuen-han's motion proposed and put. The President stated that he thought the amendment had been negatived.

Mr. K.K. FUNG claimed a division. The President then ordered the Council to divide under Standing Order 36(4).

The President announced that there were 11 votes for the amendment and 33 votes against it. (Voting record in Annex IV.) He declared that Mr. K.K. FUNG's amendment to Miss CHAN Yuen-han's motion was negatived.

Miss CHAN Yuen-han replied.

Question on Miss CHAN Yuen-han's original motion put. The President stated that he thought the motion had been negatived.

Mr. CHAN Wing-chan claimed a division. The President then ordered the Council to divide under Standing Order 36(4).

The President announced that there were 17 votes for the motion and 29 votes against it. (Voting record in Annex V.) He declared that Miss CHAN Yuen-han's motion was negatived

NEXT SITTING

In accordance with Standing Orders, the President adjourned the Council until Wednesday, 29 November 1995.

Adjourned accordingly at fourteen minutes to ten o'clock.

Last Updated on 29 July 1999