| I. | Confirmation of minutes of the 3rd meeting on 3 May 1997
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| (PLC Paper No. 201/96-97)
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| The minutes were confirmed.
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| II. | Matters arising
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| (a) Report by the Chairman on his meeting with the President and the Secretary for Policy Co-ordination of the Chief Executive's Office
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| 2. The Chairman drew members' attention to the following two points raised by the President :
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| (i) when a division had been ordered and the division bell started to ring at a Council meeting, the meeting was still in progress and that Members were required to be seated; and
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| (ii) it would be more appropriate for Members to raise any problems on the electronic voting system at the House Committee meetings, rather than at Council meetings.
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| III. | Consultation Paper on House Rules in respect of Members' Motions
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| (PLC Paper No. 203/96-97)
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| 3. In response to the Chairman's request, members agreed to advance the discussion on the consultation paper as it would have implications on the discussion of those items on the business of future Council meetings.
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| 4. At the invitation of the Chairman, Mrs Selina CHOW, Convenor of the Working Group on Rules of Procedure, explained the rationale behind the Working Group's suggestion that there should not be more than one motion/adjournment debate initiated by individual Members at any one Council meeting before 1 July 1997. She stressed that members of the Working Group were concerned that the time of the Council which ought to be used to deal with absolutely necessary issues would be taken up by debates on motions initiated by individual Members. The Working Group also suggested that there should not be any such debate on 7 June for which debate on the Budget had already been scheduled and also the last meeting of the Council before 1 July. Mrs CHOW also explained the need for Members to apply for a debate slot not less than three weeks in advance of the Council meeting concerned so that the wording of motions could be included on the agenda of the House Committee meeting for considering the business of the said meeting.
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| 5. The Chairman added that Members should consider not holding any debate on motions initiated by individual Members on 1 July 1997.
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| 6. After deliberations, members agreed that:
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| (a) with immediate effect, there should not be more than one motion/adjournment debate initiated by individual Members at each Council meeting for the period up to 1 July 1997;
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| (b) Members should apply for the allocation of a debate slot not less than three weeks in advance of the Council meeting at which the motion was to be moved. If two or more applications were received in respect of the same Council meeting, allocation would be determined by the drawing of lots by the Chairman of the House Committee;
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| (c) there would be no motion/adjournment debates initiated by individual Members at the Council meeting to be held on 7 June, the last Council meeting before 1 July and the Council meeting to be held on 1 July 1997; and
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| (d) the queuing system to enable Members who had not had the chance to move motions to be given priority in the allocation of debate slots should take effect retrospectively from the Council meeting on 10 May 1997.
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| IV. | Business arising from previous Council meetings
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| (a) Legal Adviser's report on bills referred to the House Committee in accordance with Rule 54(4)
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| National Flag and national Emblem Bill
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| Regional Flag and Regional Emblem Bill
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| (PLC Paper No. 202/96-97)
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| 7. Legal Adviser pointed out that the Bills sought to make provisions for the use and protection of the national flag and emblem and of the regional flag and emblem respectively. Some technical drafting points had been referred to the Chief Executive (CE)'s Office for clarification. Mr LIU Sing-lee added that he had also passed a list of questions on the Bills to the CE's Office and he hoped that the second reading debate on the Bills would only be resumed after he had got the response to his questions. Mr IP Kwok-him drew members' attention to the concerns expressed by the public on the extent of prohibition on the use of the regional flag and emblem and suggested that a Bills Committee be formed.
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| 8. Members agreed that a Bills Committee be formed to study the Bills and noted that the first meeting of the Bills Committee would be held immediately after the House Committee meeting.
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| (b) Election of members of the Committee on Members' Interests
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| (PLC Paper Nos. 144 and 194/96-97)
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| 9. The Chairman explained the procedure for the election of members of the Committee on Members' Interests (CMI) and invited nominations. The following Members were nominated and elected:
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| Mr NG Leung-sing
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| Professor NG Ching-fai
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| Mr LEE Kai-ming
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| Mrs TSO WONG Man-yin
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| Mr YEUNG Yiu-chung
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| Mr LIU Sing-lee
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| Mrs Miriam LAU
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| 10. The Chairman announced that the meeting be adjourned to enable the members elected to meet and elect the chairman of CMI. The meeting was adjourned at 2:40 p.m.
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| 11. The meeting resumed at 2:45 p.m. and the Chairman reported that Mrs Miriam LAU had been elected as chairman. The meeting agreed that the names of Mrs Miriam LAU and the other six Members be forwarded to the President for appointment as the chairman and members of the CMI respectively.
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| V. | Business for the Council meeting on 17 May 1997
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| (a) Paper
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| "Report of the Working Group on Administrative Matters on the provision of secretariat support to the Provisional Legislative Council on and after 1 July 1997"
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| 12. Mr IP Kwok-him, Convenor of the Working Group on Administrative Matters, reported that the Report had incorporated comments received from members and would be presented to the Council on 17 May 1997. Mr IP would also move a motion at the same Council meeting to adopt the Report and to ask the CE's Office to make the necessary legislative amendments to ensure the continued application of the Legislative Council Commission Ordinance on and after 1 July 1997.
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| 13. The Chairman reminded members that the deadline for giving notice of amendments to the motion was 10 May 1997.
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| (b) Bills
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| 14. Members noted that no notice had so far been received on the first and second readings of bills and resumption of debate on the second reading of bills for the Council meeting on 17 May 1997.
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| (c) Motions
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| 15. Members noted that apart from the motion on the adoption of the Report of the Working Group on Administrative Matters, Mr FUNG Kin-kee and Mr CHAN Choi-hi had also given notices to move motions. As members had agreed that not more than one motion debate initiated by individual Members would be allowed for each Council meeting, the Chairman advised that lots would have to be drawn if both Members were to proceed with their motions.
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| 16. Mr FUNG Kin-kee pointed out that in view of members' comments at the last House Committee meeting, he had been considering whether he should defer his motion or instead, move an amendment to the CE's Office's motion on the Budget. However, he noted from the Clerk's advice that if the Council had taken a decision on a question, no further motion should be moved in relation to that question during the same session. He therefore dropped his idea of deferring his motion unless Mr CHAN was prepared to do the same.
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| 17. Mr CHAN Choi-hi advised that he did not see the need to defer his motion which in terms of scope was not identical to that of Mr FUNG's motion.
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| 18. After clarifying with the Clerk on the procedural requirements, Mr FUNG advised that he would withdraw his motion and consider moving an amendment to Mr CHAN's motion.
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| VI. | Business for the Council meeting on 24 May 1997
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| (a) Bills
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| 19. Members noted that no notice had so far been received on the first and second readings of bills and resumption of debate on the second reading of bills for the Council meeting on 24 May 1997.
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| (b) Motions
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| 20. Dr LAW Cheung-kwok informed members that he had given notice to move a motion on Diaoyu Islands incident, but would consider withdrawing the motion after the House Committee had deliberated on the same subject which would be raised by Mr Kennedy WONG in the latter part of the meeting.
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| VII. | Any other business
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| (a) Draft House Rules (Chinese version)
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| (PLC Paper No. 204/96-97)
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| 21. The Chairman invited members to study the draft House Rules (Chinese version) which would be discussed at the next meeting of the House Committee. In the meantime, any suggestion for changes should be forwarded to Mrs Selina CHOW, Convenor of the Working Group on Rules of Procedure.
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| (b) Diaoyu Islands incident
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| (PLC Paper No. 212/96-97)
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| 22. Referring to Mr Kennedy WONG's letter, the Chairman asked whether members were agreeable to conveying to the relevant authority Members' concern about the subject and what approach should be adopted in putting across the message.
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| 23. After deliberations, members were of the view that it was proper for Members of the Provisional Legislative Council (PLC) to express their concern as it affected the integrity of China and the feelings of the people in Hong Kong. As for the manner to express Members' concern, different suggestions were raised. Some members suggested that the President be requested to take up the matter and decide which was the most appropriate way to put the message across. Mr Andrew WONG however drew members' attention to the question of whether the subject had fallen outside the scope of the work of the PLC and also that of the First Legislative Council of the HKSAR. Getting the Council and the President involved in the subject might be ultra virus. Some members echoed this point and suggested that since the situation was not clear, it would be unfair to the President if she were asked to do something which would jeopardize her neutrality in determining in future whether a subject of a similar nature ought to be debated in the Council.
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| 24. After discussion, members decided that the Chairman of the House Committee should write a letter to the relevant authority. Members also agreed that the wording of the letter would be finalized by the Chairman and Deputy Chairman of the House Committee after consulting Mr Kennedy WONG and with the assistance of the Clerk.
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| 25. Dr LAW Cheung-kwok advised members that in view of the House Committee's decision on the subject, he would withdraw his motion for the Council meeting on 24 May 1997.
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| (c) Papers for discussion at the next meeting
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| 26. The Chairman informed members that two papers would be prepared for discussion at the next meeting: one on the ceremonial and logistical arrangements on 1 July 1997 and the other on the seating arrangements for Members at Council meetings.
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| 27. The meeting ended at 3:35 p.m.
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